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cross bonding


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15 replies to this topic

#1 jl-heating

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 07:33 PM

hi just clarifying a few things here,

16th edition regs on cross bonding, i am going to NCS on properties were it has noted on a gas service sheet "no cross bonding".

i remember we used to cross bond sinks and to sink top, also cross bond across pipes on the boiler.

does anyone know the reg for this so i can check it and bounce it back to the client.

#2 Andy™

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 07:38 PM

bonding of boilers has never been an electrical reg that i know of. sink bonding was removed around 92 iirc

#3 Evans Electric

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 08:11 PM

Listen, mind your own business........ Oh sorry .......... thought you said crossdressing !! Blushing?:|

Dosn't Gorgi or whoever they are now , insist on cross bonding the heating pipes.
Forget sink bonding now, after we all wasted our time for years you don't have to do it now.

#4 batty

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 08:15 PM

Listen, mind your own business........ Oh sorry .......... thought you said crossdressing !! Blushing?:|

Dosn't Gorgi or whoever they are now , insist on cross bonding the heating pipes.
Forget sink bonding now, after we all wasted our time for years you don't have to do it now.


I personally think its a good idea after a couple of customers got pokes of sinks and on commercial I would still supp bond.
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#5 christhesparky

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 08:41 PM

Boilers only have to be cross bonded if they are in a special location (ie Bathroom) under BS7671, Under Corgi (or whoever scam gas fitters now) they may need to be bonded regardless of location

Thats as much as i can remember from my time at a plumbing & heating company, however this was about 2 yrs ago so may be out of date

hope this helps

#6 jl-heating

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 08:51 PM

i know bout the boilers, generally all the pipework is on a steel jig so its not necessary but some councils insist on it .

no i am more interested in the sink bonding i am getting defects on cross bonding were as i dont see a problem with it and dont see why heating engineers are even looking at it.

on a service cert there is a question for main bonding generally the gas bond,i know the answer really just wanted a second opinion really.

#7 Andy™

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 08:59 PM

i know bout the boilers, generally all the pipework is on a steel jig so its not necessary but some councils insist on it .

no i am more interested in the sink bonding i am getting defects on cross bonding were as i dont see a problem with it and dont see why heating engineers are even looking at it.

on a service cert there is a question for main bonding generally the gas bond,i know the answer really just wanted a second opinion really.


no requirement for kitchen sink bonding... since its not in the regs, i cant point you to a reg saying 'do not bond this'

#8 jl-heating

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 09:08 PM

thanks andy thats what i was after m8.

i have 44 properties to check with no cross bonding. i can now answer the question of why its not there.

#9 Andy™

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 09:09 PM

if they still argue, give them a copy of regs and tell em to find where it says it is req'd

#10 green-hornet

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 10:55 PM

The problem I see on this topic is there are many associations who have no idea of the wiring regulations and an even lesser knowledge of why bonding is carried out.
There is no requirement to bond anything other than the main bonding, unless under fault conditions the potential difference could cause injury or death.
A simple test if circuits are protected by a RCD is to do a continuity on all exposed metal work, that under fault conditions could become live, if the continuity is 0.05 or below there is no requirement to bond.
Why raise a potential where there is none to start with?
Which is why a full understanding of earthing arrangements should be left to electricians and not some bloke in an office who works from the 14th edition guidlines, and has no understanding of the dangers of raising the potentials beyond what they are under normal conditions.

#11 sarni31

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 11:00 PM

The problem I see on this topic is there are many associations who have no idea of the wiring regulations and an even lesser knowledge of why bonding is carried out.
There is no requirement to bond anything other than the main bonding, unless under fault conditions the potential difference could cause injury or death.
A simple test if circuits are protected by a RCD is to do a continuity on all exposed metal work, that under fault conditions could become live, if the continuity is 0.05 or below there is no requirement to bond.
Why raise a potential where there is none to start with?
Which is why a full understanding of earthing arrangements should be left to electricians and not some bloke in an office who works from the 14th edition guidlines, and has no understanding of the dangers of raising the potentials beyond what they are under normal conditions.


Well put Mr HornetApplaud Smiley
Earth potential is the important point under 17th ed regs
I think there was a little too much of "if in doubt bond it" under 16th ed regs.
Guiness Drink

#12 binky

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Posted 16 June 2009 - 07:06 PM

There is no requirement to bond anything other than the main bonding, unless under fault conditions the potential difference could cause injury or death.
A simple test if circuits are protected by a RCD is to do a continuity on all exposed metal work, that under fault conditions could become live, if the continuity is 0.05 or below there is no requirement to bond.

I always thought supplementary bonding was a requirement under 16th, (usually done at boiler as a convienient meeting points of most pipe runs in house). The cross bonds themselves being belt and braces approach to issue?


Why raise a potential where there is none to start with?

Don't see how it would raise potential if not needed anyway - same difference anyway (bad pun intended :coat)


Which is why a full understanding of earthing arrangements should be left to electricians and not some bloke in an office who works from the 14th edition guidlines, and has no understanding of the dangers of raising the potentials beyond what they are under normal conditions.


Totally concurr, there's enough disagreement and mis-information without non-sparks sticking their collective oars in Applaud SmileyApplaud SmileyApplaud Smiley

#13 green-hornet

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Posted 16 June 2009 - 07:25 PM

So true binky.

You are right about the bonding as per 16th, which to be fair always appeared to be over the top, especially when most modern houses use plastic through out, except the gas of course.

I did a job where the owner of the house had a friend who was an electrician.
Couple of days later I get a phone call from him saying I was to be reported because I had not bonded the gas boiler.
Reported for good workmanship? I asked.
NO my friend says that what you have done is dangerous.
Ok I said I will come round is your friend there?
Yes he is.

I went round to his house with the big red book and my tester.
Showed his friend the continuity readings threw the book in his direction and asked him to find me the relevant regulation I have not done.
Needless to say he could not find one.

Charged the customer 40 call out fee + 60 consultancy fee.
Pre typed before I left, and requested payment in no more than 7 days

#14 jl-heating

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Posted 16 June 2009 - 07:49 PM

excellent

#15 mercurystar999

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Posted 16 June 2009 - 08:09 PM

Did he pay?!

#16 green-hornet

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Posted 16 June 2009 - 08:39 PM

Did he pay?!


He had no option it was invoiced and I attended.




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