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Some Help With Preperation


Mitcy Dupres

Question

Hi all,

 

I am having a log cabin built (12' X 8') that I am going to use as a study and mini cinema (okay it's a man cave).  It is going to have a 2kw under floor heating system, 4 100w lights (each separately switched) a couple of 2G 13A sockets (running around 2kw) and a 1G 13A non switched socket with a separate switch (for a projector).

 

The Mrs' mate's hubby is a qualified sparky and will do all of the wiring from the house and inside the shed (it doesn't have any windows so it's not really a cabin) for free as my Mrs tutors their little girl.  

 

I am going to be running all of the conduit ready for him to use. I want to use metal clad boxes and galvanised conduit/junctions (inside of course) and have the rope inside ready for him to pull the cables through. 

 

So, here are my questions.  I'll start with the really easy ones.

 

What length m4 machine screws do I need for the conduit junction lids?

 

Do I need rubber gaskets for the junctions or is that just for outdoor applications?

 

What kind of switch would I need for the projector?

 

Can you run more than 1 cable through 20mm conduit (for the lights - they are bulkhead lights set on the walls down the length about 5' high, two on each side)?

 

I've met this guy once (nice bloke, did the wiring for my oven) and I don't want to bombard him with questions (he's doing it for nowt after all AND, doing a Computer Science degree, I know what it's like to be asked stupid questions repeatedly (everyone thinks I know everything about their computer without me being in front of it)). So instead I'm asking you (for free, I know it's hypocrisy at its best).

 

Some more questions:

 

When he brings the armoured cable in, what should it come into? (I mean, should it have a junction box ready or something else?)

 

Is he likely to wire all of this from the free point on the CU in the house?

 

Would it then split into the sockets, lights and heating?

 

The underfloor heating needs to be wired through an RCD, would this be covered by the RCD in the CU or do I need to put something else in ready for him to wire up?

 

I'm sure I'll have more questions later on, but thanks for any help.

 

 

 

 

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Ok, I'll make some suggestions,

I have a 12x8 shed, that I live in, bar the sleeping and eating, and other, bit,

UFH,  are you mad?

Throw some kingspan at it, I done mine for £100, and have a tiny 700w oil filled rad that is never hardly on unless it's below freezing outside

Next, put a dehumidifier in it, if you don't it will rot from the inside out, a better idea is actually a humidistat fan, a little 4" will do, and will also keep the air fresh inside, it will stagnate otherwise.

Why metal clad,? 

Mine is done in plastic trunking, ye, pvc conduit would look a lot neater, but galv is really overboard, imho.

As long as you keep you air spacing correct you can pull as many cables as your calcs allow through the conduit, don't worry about the 'rope',  he should have a 'fish tape' to pull the cables in. 

A very important question is, what type of earthing do you have in the house,?


Oh,

And deffo put at least one window in,

Mesh it on the outside and put a shutter on the inside if you want, but, without it it will be a dreary place on a summers evening.


Lights, 2x4' fluorescents are plenty, one on each side, or, in the apex fitted sideways with a reflector is what I have. 

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The metal clad is purely cosmetic (along with the steel conduit) to go with the bulkhead lights.  I would have it running throughout the house if the Mrs would let me, but she won't (hence the man cave).

 

The UFH will be minimal use as there will be a cavity double lined with double foil backed double bubble (I have a load lying around).  It's unlikely that it will be running at 1kw (not 2 as I stated earlier), but for the outlay costs (I'm not paying a sparky don't forget) it might as well go down under the laminate floor (I have a few sq metres lying around from when I got it at discount).  The UFH is not final, but I want to plan it in at the start rather than trying to shoe horn it in later.  Knowing what I need up front will give me a good idea of the cost and whether I ditch it and go with the oil filled rad (as was my initial plan).

 

As for the calcs, I'm not an electrician.  My idea was that each pair of lights (100w each) would have the cables running through one set of conduit, therefore having two conduits going to the 2G 4 switch box.  The conduits would run parallel up the wall to the centre of the ceiling, branch and then run down the ceiling and split with a tee shape to each light.

 

How can I find out what type of earthing I have?  It says PME next to the meter.


Being a computer geek, I'm not worried about missing the sun.  It burns!


I hadn't thought about a fan, not sure I want to cut through the tongue and groove.

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@app87 :slap :slap

steps has some good advice there!

How far is this "shed" from the house?

and IIRC you can get 45 1.0mm cables in a 20mm conduit not that you'd want to!

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You need to be asking your spark all these questions..........

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Who will be testing & certifying this work, which part of the UK are you in, will you need Part P compliance certificate as well. 100w bulkheads sounds a poor design IMHO. How much someone is or isn't being paid is irrelevant, the question is who is certifying and accepting responsibility for the safety and compliance aspects of the work. They are the person you need to be asking about how they want it designed etc.

 

Doc H.

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Are you happy with bending and threading conduit?...along with making sure it is installed correctly

If you really want the .industrial. Look. Why not do it in plastic conduit and spray paint it?

Me?.....surface trunk, end of

Just saying

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Mitcy,  a couple of points . 

 

No one uses steel conduit unless they have to these days.

 

If you do ,   you can't just have one cable in a steel conduit .    Use black plastic .

 

The whole thing will need RCD protection .

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You could save yourself a lot of trouble and buy this instead...

 

ebay 191675366847 (edited so I can post quote)

 

john...

It's been removed

you can't just have one cable in a steel conduit .    

Is this a reg?

Who will be testing & certifying this work, which part of the UK are you in, will you need Part P compliance certificate as well. 

 

He is qualified to install, test and sign off

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1: it was entertaining... shame it was removed so quickly..

 

2: line or neutral on its own wont be much use... so you need line & neutral.. but if you only use 1 per conduit then there is a reg: electromagnetic effects...

 

3: best ask him... no use you doing all that install work only to find out he isnt happy with it and wants you to start again. thats if there is someone really going to install / sign off...

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Okay, first of all, whether you agree with the design, the materials used or anything else is superfluous to my request.  It is (after all) me who is living with it and paying for it.  If it impacts regulations then it would be helpful to know.  If you have alternatives that would fit in with a heavy industrial look then that might be helpful.  

 

Secondly, I AM NOT DOING ANY WIRING, TESTING OR CERTIFYING!  I thought I made this clear in the OP.  I would not have some cowboy coming to do it.  However, as a "friend of a friend" I don't want to be bugging him with questions.  If you can't help then don't, rather than tell me to ask him.  I read through a LOT of posts in this forum before posting my question.  I gave as much information as possible, mentioned that I wasn't doing the wiring etc, yet even this doesn't seem to be acceptable for the DIY section of this forum. 

 

Thirdly, what about the rest of the questions?  For example, surely there is a standard length M4 machine screw used?


1: it was entertaining... shame it was removed so quickly..

 

2: line or neutral on its own wont be much use... so you need line & neutral.. but if you only use 1 per conduit then there is a reg: electromagnetic effects...

 

3: best ask him... no use you doing all that install work only to find out he isnt happy with it and wants you to start again. thats if there is someone really going to install / sign off...

 

1: it was entertaining... shame it was removed so quickly..

 

2: line or neutral on its own wont be much use... so you need line & neutral.. but if you only use 1 per conduit then there is a reg: electromagnetic effects...

 

3: best ask him... no use you doing all that install work only to find out he isnt happy with it and wants you to start again. thats if there is someone really going to install / sign off...

1. Shame, need a laugh.  6 weeks with the Mrs and kids.

 

2. That's good to know, how would the light at the end of the line work?

 

3.  I won't be doing anything until he says okay.  But I'd like to have a plan ready to compromise on.  These questions relate to the costing.


3. that includes digging the ditch for the conduit for the armoured cable

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no standard length screw, they come in lengths from around 10mm to over 50. generally anything 10-16 works for lids. if you really want the industrial look then go for it: but be warned that it is a lot harder than plastic trunking etc, and you will also need a conduit bender and dies etc

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Are you happy with bending and threading conduit?...along with making sure it is installed correctly

If you really want the .industrial. Look. Why not do it in plastic conduit and spray paint it?

Me?.....surface trunk, end of

Just saying

Threading, bending yeah.  Thought about spraying but that's only if I have to.

no standard length screw, they come in lengths from around 10mm to over 50. generally anything 10-16 works for lids. if you really want the industrial look then go for it: but be warned that it is a lot harder than plastic trunking etc, and you will also need a conduit bender and dies etc

next question.  Can you use a junction for right angles and what about 90 elbow couplers?

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you can use 90 degree boxes. or inspection elbow / bends

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Before I attempt the cutting, threading and joining I'm going to make a few shelves with the conduit, couplers and pallet wood (like ebay item 151782553302.  My good god look at the price) to hold some niknaks and maybe one like ebay item 271942854964.  I know scaffolding would be easier, but using the conduit would tie in with the rest of the look and give me practice cutting, threading and connecting.


What about the gasket?  is it necessary?

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Yawn......

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There is a set of tables in the Regs that tells ,you how many, and of what size/combination of cables you can have in one conduit, distance without pulling boxes etc. wherever practical i put boxes instead of bends/sets

Just saying

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Yawn......

Thanks for your help......

There is a set of tables in the Regs that tells ,you how many, and of what size/combination of cables you can have in one conduit, distance without pulling boxes etc. wherever practical i put boxes instead of bends/sets

Just saying

I would prefer boxes at bends instead of couplers/ inspection elbows so that sounds good.

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You could save yourself a lot of trouble and buy this instead...

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/191675366847?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

 

john...

 

 

here's the text for those who missed it. well worth reading

 

 

Apparently I owned this utterly crap caravan for three weeks before actually setting eyes on it. My husband drunkenly bought it on Ebay, and neglected to mention that one day he’d taken the day off work and driven halfway across the country to pick it up, deposit it around the back of our office, and failed to declare it as technically a marital ‘asset’ until recently.

Luckily, I’m the trusting type, and despite appearances I don’t think he bought it solely for the purpose of having a sordid extra-marital affair or taking up dogging, however as you might be able to see from the pictures, it would be PERFECT for both. Also pretty useful if you’re thinking of getting into murdering. I considered contacting the producers of The Fall to see if they wanted it for set dressing the next series - lets face it I’d sell my entire family for a chance to look upon Jamie Dornan with my real live eyes - but, well, life is short and ebay has been a good friend to me.

Down to details - this caravan has four walls, a roof, wheels and an interior unmatched in modern times for what I like to call, shabby ****. When I discovered I / we now owned this abomination of a wheeled device, I briefly considered starting a fun project to convert it into something cool - covering it in glitter, wallpapering the walls with fur, doing demented Cath Kidston-esque upholstery and starting an ill advised business touring festivals selling tat etc. but I’ve got two children, a job, and an idiot husband to deal with and quite frankly, time is money so I’m not going to bother.

That doesn’t mean you shouldn’t though. Think of the fun you could have in it whilst gazing out of the slightly tinted windows at rain-lashed Britain. Perhaps you could whittle a toilet for it out of the sad remains of your soul (there is a space for one). If I had a bigger garden (i.e. one where I couldn’t see this caravan) I’d let my children have it as a playhouse, but having been raised on an almost total visual diet of driftwood and White Company homewares I’m worried that they are simply far too middle class to tolerate the amount of beige laminate which makes up the interior. Nothing a few coats of paint wouldn’t fix, but like I said - ABSOLUTELY NOT to be undertaken by anyone with small children, better things to do, or indeed, any reliable form of social life.

On the other hand, if you’re the kind of person who likes to bake an egg inside an avocado, eat “clean”, sew bunting, create endless ironic pinterest boards of favourite beards and/or breton tops then this could well be just the ticket to while away those spare hours.

This apparently tows well, (although you will need a light board), does not leak, and quite frankly if you’re in the market for a **** caravan - this is the one for you! 

Cash on collection, viewings welcome, no sex pests or weirdos, no refunds, absolutely no forward rolls. Call 01604 696907 with any questions

 

*EDIT - Free idiot husband for winning bidder

 

** FURTHER EDIT - It has been brought to my attention that the "caravan" would also be suitable for use as a rolling meth lab. 

Apologies for the omission.

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Best bit was the questions and answers!!!!

 

john..

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here's some of the Q&A's, but unfortunately i only have the original page that wasnt closed from this morning

 

 

Q: Does this come with a free Tetanus injection?
A: Woefully, not.
Q: I see that this item is fairly local to me. Is it possible that you could move it further away, please? Many thanks in advance...
A: HA!
Q: Have we reached the reserve yet?
A: I have revised my expectations. We now have some way to go.
Q: ..Just curious, what's that white powder stuff outside the door?..
A: The powdered remains of my enemies
Q: Looking for a seedy cheap looking porn set. Can you confirm how many middle-aged moustached German men can be 'accommodated' comfortably and can you confirm that the brown interior is 1970's standard porn beige
A: I am afraid this caravan is MUCH TOO RICKETY to accomodate moustached German men. Danish, maybe. German - no.

 

 
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Before I attempt the cutting, threading and joining I'm going to make a few shelves with the conduit, couplers and pallet wood (like ebay item 151782553302. My good god look at the price) to hold some niknaks and maybe one like ebay item 271942854964. I know scaffolding would be easier, but using the conduit would tie in with the rest of the look and give me practice cutting, threading and connecting.

What about the gasket? is it necessary?

As mentioned the conduit will be hard work but that's up to you. IMO if you want it to look really classy use pyro and polish it up! But that's even more work and expense! :D

Black 20mm PVC conduit looks nice if well done.

BTW that shelf is made with key clamp.

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ignore post

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ignore post

Does that mean we can stop ignoring the other, more interesting , post?

Or do we now have to ignore two posts?

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we now have 2... (i somehow posted twice...)

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