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Massiccio

fireplace central heating with an extra electric water heater.

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Rob_the_rich

Where do you live Massiccio?

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binky
1 hour ago, ProDave said:

So what will circulate the water until you decide to turn the tap on?

 

back boilers utilise  a good old fashioned pump to circulate water around system. They don't separate hot water for taps from radiators, or at least my parents doesn't, hence the old fashioned advice of not drinking water from the hot tap. 

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Doc Hudson
On ‎10‎/‎3‎/‎2017 at 23:46, Doc Hudson said:

And what do the manufactures instructions for the device you intend connecting up say about your proposed configuration?  I can't quite work out which is the more dangerous, your rather sketchy proposed design? Or asking random strangers on the internet if a device that you provide no model or make or manufacture description of will work in what is a daft design arrangement. I would suggest you ring the manufactures or, just connect it up how you want and see what happens.  As I cannot see how anyone else on here could offer any more practical advice other than get a professional heating design engineer to look over your proposals.

 

Doc H

So, I shall repeat my earlier question of 3 Oct, after which 4 Oct you said you would be contacting the manufacture of this, (as yet unidentified), water heater.  Please can you understand that for people to offer you practical and useful answers to your questions, often they will ask questions back to you, to get greater detail so as to offer an appropriate answer. Without more factual detail about exactly how this proposed system is going to be connected up, (e.g. drawing/.plan/sketch of the system), our members are guessing. You may as well ask any random vague question you like to a complete stranger at a bus stop and expect them to be able to connect your system up. Based upon the vagueness of your question I fail to see how you can interpret any of the very constructive answers given so far as "no can do Jaba Jaba"?

 

Re the 15l 3kw under sink water heater:- 

1) What is the Make of this proposed water heater?

2) What is the model number of this proposed water heater?

3) What do the manufactures installation instructions say?

4) What was the response for the inquires you said you were going to make?  (Or didn't you contact the manufacture?)

 

Please answer each of the above points, otherwise I would have to assume this is just a 'wind-up' thread with no possible genuine answer actually needed.

 

 

  

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Lurch
1 hour ago, binky said:

back boilers utilise  a good old fashioned pump to circulate water around system. They don't separate hot water for taps from radiators, or at least my parents doesn't, hence the old fashioned advice of not drinking water from the hot tap. 

 

I think you've got a few systems mixed up there. Having a back boiler doesn't mean you can't drink water from taps.

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SLIPSHOD & SLAPDASH

Even if this did work, i donr know any undersink type 3kw water heater that  passes water though, they are stored water.

The only thing similar to what you want is a standard hot water cylinder fitted with a 3kw immersion but even the smallest wont fit under a  sink and i doubt the heater could keep up with the flow, its designed to heat the water static in the cylinder.

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ProDave

Willis heater?

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Doc Hudson

https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Main_Index/Domestic_Index/Instantaneous_Water_Heaters/index.html#Rho_Instantaneous

Any quick Google will bring up a varied selection of possible instantaneous water heaters, an example of some is above. Plus you can view the installation instructions on line.  However the smaller power items are typically for a single tap application, whereas I get the impression you are looking to feed all the hot taps in the property?  What is the 'heater' you are considering? I presume you have searched optional products before starting a project such as this. 

 

Doc H.

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Tony S
10 hours ago, Lurch said:

 

I think you've got a few systems mixed up there. Having a back boiler doesn't mean you can't drink water from taps.

 

 

If you’ve seen the amount of shyte that builds up in a convection back boiler you wouldn’t want to drink the hot water.

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Lurch
6 hours ago, Tony S said:

 

If you’ve seen the amount of shyte that builds up in a convection back boiler you wouldn’t want to drink the hot water.

 

I never said you would, that is why you generally have a hot water tank with an indirect coil.

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Tony S
1 hour ago, Lurch said:

 

I never said you would, that is why you generally have a hot water tank with an indirect coil.

 

 

Convection back boilers used a direct hot water cylinder, the water going through the boiler was the same water coming out of the tap.

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Lurch
Just now, Tony S said:

Convection back boilers used a direct hot water cylinder

 

Some did.

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binky

my parents does, I'm fairly sure. The old don't drink from the hot water tap is supposed to be due metallic contamination from lead pipes, but then my parents also fill the kettle from the cold tap last thing at night to avoid the same thing. There's not an inch of lead in their house :slap

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Blue Duck

I thought it was incase there was a drowned rat in the header tank?

 

Knew an establishment where the staff were showering in rotting rat carcass' for months...

 

:lol:

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Lurch
1 hour ago, binky said:

The old don't drink from the hot water tap is supposed to be due metallic contamination from lead pipes,

 

Does lead contamination only occur in hot pipes? I think the 'don't drink from the hot tap' thing is because of the stored water.

 

1 hour ago, Blue Duck said:

Knew an establishment where the staff were showering in rotting rat carcass' for months...

 

Fairly common on commercial properties. Was very rare to remove a header tank from a school or small office block and not find pigeons and rats in them.

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Doc Hudson

Well I assume at some point this link will have to be added, so I think I will do it now.

 

Doc H.

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phil d
On 10/11/2017 at 19:04, Tony S said:

 

Convection back boilers used a direct hot water cylinder, the water going through the boiler was the same water coming out of the tap.

Primatic cylinder iirc, it used an air bubble to maintain some type of separation, if anything upset it then you got sludgy water out of the hot tap.

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Massiccio
On 10/10/2017 at 23:01, Massiccio said:

Finally someone who can give constructive advice instead of no-can-do jaba jaba LOL. Thanks man. One love!

And to avoid danger of legionella won't I just need to isolate the mains from the close circuit with a valve which will open only when I'll open a tap along the closed circuit, so that fresh water can flow in?? Thx 

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Massiccio
On 10/10/2017 at 23:19, ProDave said:

So what will circulate the water until you decide to turn the tap on?

 

Mains water into a circulating heating loop then out of a tap. I cannot begin to tell you how many rules and water bylaws you are proposing to break. And yes Legionaires is a REAL risk with what you propose.

 

This thread should be deleted, because this reputable forum cannot play any part in helping you do something so blatantly dangerous in so many ways

if what u saying is true EVERYONE who during the summer has a water hose in the garden would create legionaires !! ;)

 

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Doc Hudson
9 minutes ago, Massiccio said:

if what u saying is true EVERYONE who during the summer has a water hose in the garden would create legionaires !! ;)

 

 

Yes, you are quite correct it is that dangerous, hence the some of the warnings in this thread about the dangers of your proposed arrangement. Have a google and you will probably find articles such as these; 

https://newsroom.unsw.edu.au/news/science-tech/garden-hose-breeding-ground-legionnaires’-disease

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4608122/Man-63-dies-Legionnaires-working-garden.html

Not sure it is something to smile or wink about though? 

 

Doc H.

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Rob_the_rich

On a central heating system, just installing a non-return valve would not be enough to satisfy water regulations,  A removeable link should be fitted and disconnected after filling. 

See https://www.wras.co.uk/consumers/advice_for_consumers/what_are_the_water_regulations_/

And https://www.planningportal.co.uk/info/200135/approved_documents/69/part_g_-_sanitation_hot_water_safety_and_water_efficiency

For starters.

Where do you live Massiccio? I mean roughly, not your address.

Edited by Rob_the_rich

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phil d

I used to work in a large hotel and as a building services engineer part of my job was to ensure there was no chance of an outbreak of Legionnaires disease, we had strict procedures in place, water stored above a certain temperature, all shower heads removed on a monthly basis and sanitized ( we actually had 2 sets, 1in use and the other stored clean). Filters had to be checked regularly, air handling units cleaned and inspected, it was one hell of a responsibility, you can quite easily kill a lot of people by not following the correct procedure. JTF wholesale were recently found guilty of causing the death of two men and several others to be hospitalised, when they set up a demonstration hot tub in one of their stores, as it was only to look at and wasn't having people using it they didn't follow the correct protocols, and as a result there was an outbreak of Legionnaires. I've known of quite a few outbreaks and each case has resulted in somebody being given a prison sentence!

That was the main reason I parted company with the hotel, far too much responsibility for far too little pay.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-stoke-staffordshire-40479742

Edited by phil d

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Andy™
4 hours ago, phil d said:

I used to work in a large hotel and as a building services engineer

 

how many jobs have you had?! you seem to have worked for everyone

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Lurch

@phil d is Nessa!

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phil d
1 hour ago, Andy™ said:

 

how many jobs have you had?! you seem to have worked for everyone

 I liked to move around a lot, after getting made redundant about a year after coming out of my time, I decided to look after number one and sod everybody else! I kept moving around, a few years here a few years there, if I was offered more money then I went, simple as that, If I didn't like the working conditions I went, it made for a variety of experiences and was a lot of fun.

Take the hotel for example, the advert was for a maintenance engineer, the other 2 lads were an ex postman, and a diyer, lol.When they found out what I could do they put me in charge of building systems, looking after not only the day to day stuff, but also the telecoms, ITnetwork and a lot of other stuff, In one week alone I saved them £3k by doing some repair work in house that was previously done externally ( stainless steel welding), unfortunately after 6 months of proving myself I asked for another £1 an hour, they were not forthcoming so it was tools in the truck and move on.

I did about 2 years at BT, then got out as it was going silly, went to NTL telewest, just as they were being taken over by VM, left after a spat with management, got asked to go back by VM, sorted a load of lettuced out for them on the local network, and was then replaced by a pillock who'd been fired by NTL for being carrotted at work, in the telecoms game a lot of it is on the "old boy " network, you can get away with murder if you are one of the lads, I wasn't!

I've absolutely no loyalty to anyone except myself these days and it suits me that way, get bored and move on.

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