I recently had a new boiler installed by British Gas and the work was all completed no problems. Now I’ve had some electric work done in the kitchen and as part of that I’m having my fuse board upgraded to be RCD protected. However the electrician won’t sign the work off as he can’t see any earth bonds on the water or gas. My question is should BG have completed the works without them knowing where these were? The electrician wants to charge me more to install them and then sign off the work. Obviously I don’t want to pay any more if BG should have ensured they were there before installing the boiler.
Earthing bonds when installing a boiler
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Sharpend
"It Just Is"
How did he test for the evidence of no bonds?
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He should have checked things like that and warned you before starting the job that some upgrades are needed. Not just refuse to sign it off.
He said he couldn’t see them anywhere. And also on the pre survey by BG they said the same
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So 2 people tell you there is no earth bonding and then you are surprised to get charged to install it?
If BG had insisted it was done before they did their work you would still have had to pay for it and probably more to them than the electrician.
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Sounds like you need to spend some money and get them done....
I do have some sympathy for the customer here.
Surely the electrician who quoted for the update work should have spotted the absence of bonding at that stage, not made it an, "essential extra", after the event.
After all, it's pretty obvious in most installations.
Having got to this stage though, is the extra work involved worth the loss of goodwill that is inevitably going to result?
Surely the electrician who quoted for the update work should have spotted the absence of bonding at that stage, not made it an, "essential extra", after the event.
After all, it's pretty obvious in most installations.
Having got to this stage though, is the extra work involved worth the loss of goodwill that is inevitably going to result?
When I quote for a CU change I show this as an extra cost if required ..........................
My estimates also include a caveat:
"If any problems are detected during the fuseboard change additional work may be required. Such issues and associated costs will be discussed with you prior to them being implemented"
Never had this caveat challenged, or questioned.
Best to be upfront with people IMHO
My estimates also include a caveat:
"If any problems are detected during the fuseboard change additional work may be required. Such issues and associated costs will be discussed with you prior to them being implemented"
Never had this caveat challenged, or questioned.
Best to be upfront with people IMHO
The Bonding could well be there (and electrically testable) but has become hidden behind plasterboard etc or, under floors etc. depending on where the services enter the building. Often happens with garage conversions.
Officially it needs to be capable of inspection too as the size and termination of the cable matters - not just that it still exists 'somewhere'.
Although you can make a stand over it if you have unarguable previous evidence of it 'being there' the easiest route with least potential for trouble or 'forced additional work' at future inspections / visiting gas/electrical/plumbing / tradespeople is to have a new bond of the right type fitted that is and will remain visible.
Check the Electrician is a member of an appropriate body and willing to sign it all off when it is done
Officially it needs to be capable of inspection too as the size and termination of the cable matters - not just that it still exists 'somewhere'.
Although you can make a stand over it if you have unarguable previous evidence of it 'being there' the easiest route with least potential for trouble or 'forced additional work' at future inspections / visiting gas/electrical/plumbing / tradespeople is to have a new bond of the right type fitted that is and will remain visible.
Check the Electrician is a member of an appropriate body and willing to sign it all off when it is done
Correct me if I am remembering this incorrectly ...but.... did I not read somewhere that when quoting for some extra wiring , the lack of main bonding connections MUST be addressed ..and I'm sure I read .... you shouldn't / or can't / carry out the work if the client won't pay for missing bonding .
It may have been one of those NICEIC Q & A things .
The other point is , of course, when filling in the cert . you can't tick the bonding boxes.
It may have been one of those NICEIC Q & A things .
The other point is , of course, when filling in the cert . you can't tick the bonding boxes.
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You are indeed correct Sirrah
i have connected heating systems up for my plumber and the bonding has cost more than the heating connection
i will try to find the Reg in my searchable online thingy
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132.16 Additions and alterations to an installation
No addition or alteration, temporary or permanent, shall be made to an existing installation, unless it has been ascertained that the rating and the condition of any existing equipment, including that of the distributor, will be adequate for the altered circumstances. Furthermore, the earthing and bonding arrangements, if necessary for the protective measure applied for the safety of the addition or alteration, shall be adequate.
(IET 21)
IET. BS 7671:2018 Requirements for Electrical Installations, IET Wiring Regulations, 18th Edition. Institution of Engineering & Technology (IET), 07/2018. VitalBook file.
Simples!
how long did that take?
No addition or alteration, temporary or permanent, shall be made to an existing installation, unless it has been ascertained that the rating and the condition of any existing equipment, including that of the distributor, will be adequate for the altered circumstances. Furthermore, the earthing and bonding arrangements, if necessary for the protective measure applied for the safety of the addition or alteration, shall be adequate.
(IET 21)
IET. BS 7671:2018 Requirements for Electrical Installations, IET Wiring Regulations, 18th Edition. Institution of Engineering & Technology (IET), 07/2018. VitalBook file.
Simples!
how long did that take?
8 minutes !!! Strange ....there are few things remaining in my long term memory banks these days but I managed to unearth that gem.
I do seem to struggle with important stuff like the width of the Green stripey on earth wires compared to the Yellow stripey . (I also tend to wonder about the poor souls who find it of any interest whatsoever . )
I do seem to struggle with important stuff like the width of the Green stripey on earth wires compared to the Yellow stripey . (I also tend to wonder about the poor souls who find it of any interest whatsoever . )
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Sharpend
"It Just Is"
Has anyone checked how many earths are at the MET? Just as an indicator of course, they may have been cut/disconnected at some point in the history of the house.
At least then we’d know if it’s worth testing for any form of connected bond. :C
At least then we’d know if it’s worth testing for any form of connected bond. :C
No it seems its more important to check out the width of the Green / Yellow stripes on the cables. :shakehead
I have actually pulled a job for that, it was a CE marking audit on an American machine, and the same requirement is in the machinery standards.
If, the machine OEM is claiming a presumption of conformity by following harmonised standards (they were) then they must comply with them in full.
They didn't, they used American GREEN & yellow, the width of the yellow stripe was about 1mm spiral wrapping around the wire with a pitch of about 50mm, so nowhere near the standards requirement.
Bearing in mind, I was being paid by the client to find any deviations from the standards.
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I was aware of the 70-30 rule as I have pulled a few things for it. Was not aware of the 15mm one for busbars though
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