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legal rights


binky

Question

If a customer aks us to obtain and supply goods for them, which involves mucho time running around finding things and researching stuff, what legal comeback do we have to charge for time spent doing this, if any????.

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cant you just issue the reciept for the goods and get her to return it her self? that way your only a collection and delivery service of goods? just charge for time collecting the item?

This is what I should have done in the first place, but being the helpuful person I am, I ordered it through my wholsaler account. She still owes me for that anyway, which is why I was asking about legal rights for charging labour.

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sorry, just getting this straight,

u sourced and fitted a fire

she wants to change it,

have u been paid anything yet?

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Nicky Tesla

there is no cold calling here cos she invited you round for the digital tv. She also asked YOU to source and supply the fire, it was not a contract created by you. If anything it should be you, who has the 7 days to think about whether you are going to take the job on or not. If she saw the fire before you fitted it, then shes bought it. The manufacturer did not tell you at the time of purchase that "if it gets fitted,then we will not accept it back". You basically have supplied the fire, the same as the manufacturer has supplied the fire to you. So do you get 7 days yourself, remember she invited you in and made the suggestion herself, you did-not go in prepared with brochures.

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This whole story makes me cross. I have had dealings with old folks in my past career and they can really get up your nose. You try to help them and they bugger you about. I think if she had brought it from a shop and used it for a day they would not take it back. I could be wrong but how are companies going to make money if people return used goods surely they cannot sell them once they have been used. I am no legal expert but this whole thing stinks.

Batty

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NozSpark

Nicky,

go have a look at that link that I posted..

It does not matter if you are invited or not.. it all still comes under the doorstep selling regulations I'm afraid

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Robin Spark

This post sort of reminds me when I was at college and worked for a retailer selling camping equipment. Customers used to buy tents knowing they had 28 days for refund or exchange. Then they would go on hols for a week and bring back tent for a refund saying it wasnt the right one etc..

I caught them out a few times when I unpacked the tent in middle of shop and found a load of mud and grass on the ground sheet!!!

But, there were loads of times that refunds were given when you just knew but couldnt prove things against them.

So as we all know, you have got the good and bad customers and the bad ones just get rid of! If you have been paid money to cover your labour then just take the fire away and then they will have to pay someone else again to do the work.

Just wondering have you told wholesaler what has happened? Do you still have original packaging in good condition for fire so you could return it? Or does it have security seal on box so its obvious its been opened?

Otherwise you could try EBAY you never know until you give it a go.

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if u have been paid, there is not alot she can do, its just weather or not u think it will affect your rep or not

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NozSpark

Under the doorstep selling regulations you are screwed,, unless you got her to sign a waiver to allow you to start work before the cooling period...

Nave a look here

http://www.berr.gov.uk/whatwedo/consumers/buying-selling/Doorstep-selling/FAQs/page29175.html

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Under the doorstep selling regulations you are screwed,, unless you got her to sign a waiver to allow you to start work before the cooling period...

Nave a look here

http://www.berr.gov.uk/whatwedo/consumers/buying-selling/Doorstep-selling/FAQs/page29175.html

Tell me about it - I think this is a hard lesson learn't, and will put me off helping little old ladies ever again, leaving more opportunities for rogues. What is most concerning is that the legislation doesn't seem to allow for short notice work, basically it says we sholud not start any work for a week minimum, which doesn't help much with a lot of small domestic jobs like changing light fittings. I am most certainly not happy about it as it looks like I will be left out of pocket for trying to be helpful :(:(:(

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NozSpark

You can get them to sign a waiver so that you can start within the 7 days...

however they can still cancel the contract, but they have to pay for labour and materials used (possibly even ordered in materials)

I never buy anything like this for clients, not even (special) light fittings.... "get it yourself,I'll then come back and fit".. did they OK the heater from a picture??

I think you need to try the softly soflty approach.. if you are reasonable with them, then hopefully they will be reasonably with you!

For future... money upfront for special purchases!! or they get it themselves!!

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Nicky Tesla

i often say " you source it, ill fit it" everybodys got tinternet these days let them do it.

If it takes a long time to source then any mark up wont be worth it especially when the customer goes straight on tinternet to find how much youve ripped them off.

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Andy™

add a percentage to all your materials

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Apache

Sounds like you've spent the time, maybe got the stuff and then lost the job?

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You would include that in your price - Surely?

Normally yes but not always - in this particular case the customer asked me to obtain an electric fire (whilst I was sorting out her TV (digital switchover)) because they couldn't get it themselves (being elderly), and various relatives were away on business or recovering from surgery, so couldn't help. So I duly took time out to help being sympathetic to elderly people and duly supplied said item as specified by themselves. Customer uses product for a day then decides she doesn't like it and wants to return goods -"'its not the same as the old one (which she bought 40 years ago)". So she asked me to see if I could fix old one - surprisingly parts are not available, or source a different model more to her liking, so several hours spent on internet/ wholesalers and phoning manufacturers, for which I wasn't going to charge. Anyway, due to cutomer being hard of hearing I typed a letter pointing out that there is no alternative to the fire supplied,the old one can't be fixed and a service charge is applicable if returned (levelled by manufacturer not me) and could she let me know how she wishes to proceed. Next thing I'm getting letters from Age Concern stating that under legislation she has a right to cancel contract and return goods. Problem is the manufacturer was also contacted, and is refusing to re-stock item because it has been used, even if only for a day, which leaves me out of pocket to the tune of

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Andy™

not sure what can be done etc, but from her side, distance selling may apply?

but if she asked you to install and she knew what she was getting, im sure you could claim agreed labour costs as a minimum

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That's kind of what I was thinking, but don't know of a legal precedent for this. What really irritates is the assumption that I'm some sort of rogue trader trying to rip off an old lady, plus her niece (who I think has propmted this action) could of at leat called me first before going elsewhere. In short, I went round on a Sunday afternoon to sort TV (she sounded really desperate), back again on Monday to show her how to use TV again, back 2 days later to fit fire, which initially she was reasonably happy with, back again several days later to collect payment (not forth coming) and spent a further 2 hours trying to mend/ find alternative new fire, for which I added no mark up on parts and was going to charge a nominal

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Apache

I'd write a polite letter back to the old lady and copy it to age concern detailing what you did and how you were trying to help her out at very little cost. Just calmly detailsing things as you have here might make her see sense and the favour you were doing her?

As far as distance selling goes there is a 7 day cooling off period - Don't know if this applies if something is used?

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I'd write a polite letter back to the old lady and copy it to age concern detailing what you did and how you were trying to help her out at very little cost. Just calmly detailsing things as you have here might make her see sense and the favour you were doing her?

As far as distance selling goes there is a 7 day cooling off period - Don't know if this applies if something is used?

Its the 7 day bit that they are quoting. But there are bits in the legislation about goods that can't be returned, and I would have thought that used electrical goods were covered by that???

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Apache

Been doing a search and the right to cancel within 7 days is void if:

The trader has already started to provide the service within the cancellation period and you have agreed to this

http://www.consumerdirect.gov.uk/after_you_buy/buying_at_home/returning-cancelling/

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Been doing a search and the right to cancel within 7 days is void if:

http://www.consumerdirect.gov.uk/after_you_buy/buying_at_home/returning-cancelling/

yeah, but its supposed to be stated in writing headbang

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Anyway I've got a callout to deal with so will be back later.

I did try to trace my rights, but haven't found anything yet.

Back soon and thanks for your help

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green-hornet

I find this thread very interesting as the effects can and probably will effect all of us given time.

I am no expert but I would have thought the return of goods would always be the supplier or manufacturers problem and covered by their strict rulings.

The fact that they did not like it as well as the old one is not just cause for a return.

I would suggest that before you take pity on any elderly people, remember they are just like any other client, and with involvement from greedy do good relatives waiting for the final will being read,are more prone to complain and abuse your good will than others.

Before anyone calls me callous, just remember you are providing a service, and your sympathy has clouded your judgement.

I would write to age concern and explain in factual detail what you did for this customer, I would finish the letter off, with your personal feelings of hurt and disbelief that a third party have been involved.

Offer them the oppertunity to ask questions and if need be provide a solution to this problem.

Failing that take them to court and sue them.

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Apache

Now under the 'electrical and gas appliance' section the customer has a right to repair replacement or refund:

If you have bought an electrical or gas appliance, it must be of satisfactory quality, fit for its purpose and as described.

The fire was all of those things.

http://www.consumerdirect.gov.uk/after_you_buy/know-your-rights/electrical/

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