it's a common misconception that what we charge is mostly profit. It isn't, it mostly covers overheads.
Starting out!
- Thread starter JakeASimpson
- Start date
Help Support Talk Electrician Forum:
3-5 year plan. Stay with current firm until you get to approved. Next ask to go for technicians course whatever it is these days...firm pays all good. Next get every certificate going that's relevant to your field, IPAF PASMA any relevant health and safety courses, See if company will put in for a supervisor's card from jib...another nice to have toy. Get absolutely everything that your current firm can offer you - if they do niceic stuff then see if you can get on as a quality supervisor, again its another door opener. Start talking to people when your running jobs, Get important peoples numbers, have them know you by name ect ect ect, THEN after doing all that you can look to either start taking on your own work. At least then you will have saved yourself thousands of pounds in "necessary" courses.
Think of your outgoings when working out how much you will need.
Public Liability
Van insurance
Tools (Full set of test equipment - zero change out of £1k)
Advertising
Membership of a registered body
Food while at work ect
Fuel
Rent for premises (Depends what you need)
Accountant
Secretary to keep paper work in order (Normally as a sole trader you will do this but will you pay yourself ? )
Sufficient cash flow to deal with the fact that you could be laying out say £1k+ on materials and then waiting 90 days for that £1k back regardless of any profit (Im saying 90 days as a worst case when dealing with some big builders or other larger companies)
I know it's boring ect but to be honest if you are with a JIB registered firm who are paying the proper rates and you are getting overtime at double bubble ect then in all honesty you would be mad to leave. Loads of self employed guys would snap your arm off to swap. Whatever you do don't burn your bridges. That's my most important piece of advice.
Think of your outgoings when working out how much you will need.
Public Liability
Van insurance
Tools (Full set of test equipment - zero change out of £1k)
Advertising
Membership of a registered body
Food while at work ect
Fuel
Rent for premises (Depends what you need)
Accountant
Secretary to keep paper work in order (Normally as a sole trader you will do this but will you pay yourself ? )
Sufficient cash flow to deal with the fact that you could be laying out say £1k+ on materials and then waiting 90 days for that £1k back regardless of any profit (Im saying 90 days as a worst case when dealing with some big builders or other larger companies)
I know it's boring ect but to be honest if you are with a JIB registered firm who are paying the proper rates and you are getting overtime at double bubble ect then in all honesty you would be mad to leave. Loads of self employed guys would snap your arm off to swap. Whatever you do don't burn your bridges. That's my most important piece of advice.
Not true , as you can see . This is a different Forum , people put themselves out to help others.
Sharpend
"It Just Is"
I think Jake is somewhat envious or misunderstanding of the difference between the two, for company charge out rate which the customer may pay is based upon costs of running a business and all that running a business offers the customer- call outs, immediate response, less waiting time etc.
A one man band, it is unlikely that the customer will pay the same as the pay for a full blown company, as they aren't stupid and know you don't have the same costs etc.
If you accept that a employed spark will generally be paid at jib rates and the self employed may get nearly double but have higher expenses to run as self employed.
A one man band, it is unlikely that the customer will pay the same as the pay for a full blown company, as they aren't stupid and know you don't have the same costs etc.
If you accept that a employed spark will generally be paid at jib rates and the self employed may get nearly double but have higher expenses to run as self employed.
Or just missing the point which running a business is far more expensive than being a one man band.....
The boss and the office staff don't get charged out in most cases so their costs have to be funded for a start and then there are premises to pay for!
Exactly what I was getting at..
Put it it this way... About 20 years ago I was being billed out at ITRO £65/hr.... was I paid anywhere near that? prob more like <£10/hr
was I bothered? No
because they paid for the building, lighting, heating, business rates, cooperation tax, loads of other taxes, tools, training,my apprenticeship, sick pay, holiday pay, employers portions of income tax, ni, pension, uniform, break times, it systems, additional non chargeable employees, writing contracts...
oh,,, and my employer never bought any spares,,, they were all client supplied.... and I've probably missed loads of items from that list
JakeASimpson
Member
I don't want to be on a JIB rate anymore. Limiting my earnings. I want to go on my own. I know two local electricians that do well, one is just a one man band and the other has two other people working with him, he lives in a large house, nice holidays and he is only a domestic electrician. The grass may not be greener on the other side, but I will never know if I stick on salary.
Doc Hudson
Moderator
- Joined
- Oct 21, 2008
- Messages
- 5,620
- Reaction score
- 230
Your knowledge of two local electricians is a red-herring in your business plan. (Remember there will be just as many local electricians who are not doing well, who struggle each month to pay the bills, are wishing they had a regular contracted full time job with holidays, sick pay, pension contributions etc. ) However back to the point of you starting your own business. Have you done a rough expenditure projection model on a spread sheet for the first few years to compare what you need in with what you will have going out. And have you done marketing investigations into your proposed customer base. The work you are hoping to get is currently being done by somebody else. Why will these customers change and select you for the work? What is your unique selling point. How many people are you currently turning down each week asking you to do work that you can't do due to your existing employment? If you have genuinely done the number crunching and the figures all add up to a reasonable cash flow and profit and you have prospective customers lined up, then why are you waiting, go ahead and do it.
However if you are just wishing for something better that you haven't fully researched then make sure you also have a good second back up plan in the likely event that you venture fails. Remember more small businesses fail in the first five years than those that succeed. That said, another statistic is that people often have less regrets about trying to start a business that fails, rather than never trying in the first place. The bottom line is if you really want to do it, have a go. See if it really does live up to your expectations, but don't for one minute think you will have loads of spare time for the first few years, as it take lots of hard work, time and commitment to establish a successful small business. Often some of the best success comes when you can do a dual role, starting your new work part time whilst still retaining some existing employment, although some contract terms may prohibit business activities in a field that could be considered competitive to your current employment.
Doc H.
However if you are just wishing for something better that you haven't fully researched then make sure you also have a good second back up plan in the likely event that you venture fails. Remember more small businesses fail in the first five years than those that succeed. That said, another statistic is that people often have less regrets about trying to start a business that fails, rather than never trying in the first place. The bottom line is if you really want to do it, have a go. See if it really does live up to your expectations, but don't for one minute think you will have loads of spare time for the first few years, as it take lots of hard work, time and commitment to establish a successful small business. Often some of the best success comes when you can do a dual role, starting your new work part time whilst still retaining some existing employment, although some contract terms may prohibit business activities in a field that could be considered competitive to your current employment.
Doc H.
Last edited by a moderator:
Sharpend
"It Just Is"
As Doc says, if you really want to be self employed then do, if you choose at a later point that it's not for you then don't.
Just don't expect to have what everybody else has as that's a recipe for disaster as you're not them. Be happy with what you do and get, remember the more you have the more you have to lose. And if you've had it and lose it its twice as painful as not having it in the first place.
Just don't expect to have what everybody else has as that's a recipe for disaster as you're not them. Be happy with what you do and get, remember the more you have the more you have to lose. And if you've had it and lose it its twice as painful as not having it in the first place.
I think generally speaking those that choose to go into business for the money will not be as successful as those that choose to go into business because they love what they do. To be successful, whatever your criteria of that is, you need to love what you do. Want to do the best you can, everyday. 20 hour days , 7 days a week mentality. All those that I know that run successful businesses do not do it for the money. They do it because they are passionate about what they do. Their work is their hobby. If you looked at their 'salary' then you might say they are doing well. Take that salary and divide it by the true number of hours worked to keep the business running then they would probably be better off on minimum wage cleaning toilets. But as I said. They are not in it for the money.
I may be completely wrong but to me it sounds like you are only looking at this from a money point of view with no real understanding of what is required in order to get it.
BLOODY HELL ESSEX!
I find myself agreeing with you!
I find myself agreeing with you!
Up yours!Canoeboy said:
Manator
©Honorary Essex Boy™
Classic
BLOODY HELL ESSEX!
I find myself agreeing with you!
Are you ill? I’ve got some spare tranquilisers if you need them.
2nd thoughts, I need them more than you.
BLOODY HELL ESSEX!
I find myself agreeing with you!
there is an easy fix to this problem you have...
Ruzzeii
KippeR
swings and round abouts m8, but then this is coming from someone who has never been employed by a employer
