safedepth
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Is this a way of saying "buy my product or I cancel my sponsorship"?
Fitting Different Make Mcbs Etc
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I read it as this form of advertising MAY not suit my business, will see how things go.
Nice try Safedepth, but I won't rise to the bait. The only reason I would want you or anyone to buy my product is if you thought it was a step forward with regard to circuit protection. I believe in it, but I am happy to solicit opinions from fellow professionals. What I really needed from you Safedepth, was your view on Compact RCBOs and your view on mix and match. I still need your views.
Hi Wozz,
You are absolutely right and the very reason I agreed with management to trial Sponsorship. I already do significant business and it is all word-of-mouth and it is sales to tradesmen ONLY. That is why i don't have a website. This is my first venture into advertising with this side of my business and I always knew it would be tough to move people away from split boards and to crystallise their views on BSEN60439. We will see how things go.
Hi Wozz,
You are absolutely right and the very reason I agreed with management to trial Sponsorship. I already do significant business and it is all word-of-mouth and it is sales to tradesmen ONLY. That is why i don't have a website. This is my first venture into advertising with this side of my business and I always knew it would be tough to move people away from split boards and to crystallise their views on BSEN60439. We will see how things go.
Dave,
the ONLY reason I havent yet ordered from you is I am still waiting confirmation of what sizes I actually need,
and yes,
I will have the 2 x metal clad boards , and the C type RCBOs if they are available in the sizes I require, specifically the 20's, the others are not so critical.
work has just went a bit stupid this week with everyone wanting it done by next Friday, just got home at 8.30 tonight. :|
the ONLY reason I havent yet ordered from you is I am still waiting confirmation of what sizes I actually need,
and yes,
I will have the 2 x metal clad boards , and the C type RCBOs if they are available in the sizes I require, specifically the 20's, the others are not so critical.
work has just went a bit stupid this week with everyone wanting it done by next Friday, just got home at 8.30 tonight. :|
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Dave I shall be ordering some more in fact I have a job coming up end of this month that I shall be using them on.
the debates over 60439 were inevitable, interesting and we certainly havnt got to the bottom of it, it is just a very confusing thing that the manufs havnt made clear. Which I would have thought they would have if it was really that black and white. The phase i have dug out of the MK tech spec is 'additional testing MAY be required'. Not much help for the average installer is it.
At the end of the day i believe we are here (on the forum) as we are the part of the industry that likes to go one step further know their job a bit more than most and try to stay one step a head with products and ideas. I would say people that put the extra effort into their jobs would be the hardest people to convince with regard to 60439 as we like to adhere to what we read.
Shame what the are reading in this case is such a wafty neither here nor there type thing, which is ironic as thats exactly how I would describe
314.1
And has been said a trillion times on here and everywhere else, the regs are for guidance, nothing to say they are right or wrong, in fact the latter would seem more appropriate, due to the amount of changes they keep making which in my opinion is just about money making, keep the wheel turning, keep the income coming, keep making them money.
If its safe do it.
If its safe do it.
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The way I see it is this if the circuit breaker/ RCBO/ Main switch Etc are physically the same ie you do not have to modify the busbar cover or any other part of the enclosure to make the device fit. Then surely as they are made to the same standard they will operate the same if there is a fault and will clear the fault in the same way.
I have been using TD line RCBO's in MK consumer units for a few years now. TD line RCBO's are physically the same and are probably made in the same factory as the MK ones. I don't use TD line consumer units as they have a plastic din rail and if loaded with RCBO's they seem a bit flimsy to me. Big difference is cost. They are half the price of MK so its possible to do an RCBO consumer unit for a reasonable price.
When my stock runs out I shall be changing over to Daves consumer units as I like the compact RCBO's. I can see where Sidey is going with this ie if there is a problem with the consumer unit and you have used none genuine parts you may not have a leg to stand on with the manufacturer. With Daves stuff I put my confidence in what he sells. I haven't fitted much yet but what I have has been spot on when testing so I have every confidence in what he sells.
I have been using TD line RCBO's in MK consumer units for a few years now. TD line RCBO's are physically the same and are probably made in the same factory as the MK ones. I don't use TD line consumer units as they have a plastic din rail and if loaded with RCBO's they seem a bit flimsy to me. Big difference is cost. They are half the price of MK so its possible to do an RCBO consumer unit for a reasonable price.
When my stock runs out I shall be changing over to Daves consumer units as I like the compact RCBO's. I can see where Sidey is going with this ie if there is a problem with the consumer unit and you have used none genuine parts you may not have a leg to stand on with the manufacturer. With Daves stuff I put my confidence in what he sells. I haven't fitted much yet but what I have has been spot on when testing so I have every confidence in what he sells.
if there is a problem with the consumer unit and you have used none genuine parts you may not have a leg to stand on with the manufacturer
I understand this, but when was the last time you had a problem with a consumer unit, take away the devices its a box, a box that is not meant to catch fire thats about all i know about it. Ive had burnt connections on bussbars before but that isnt anything to do with the box it was the devices and bussbar.
The only thing i can think of when its more than a box is the conditional 16kA thing and back up protection, I cant remember the last time i had 6kA in a domestic property.
I understand this, but when was the last time you had a problem with a consumer unit, take away the devices its a box, a box that is not meant to catch fire thats about all i know about it. Ive had burnt connections on bussbars before but that isnt anything to do with the box it was the devices and bussbar.
The only thing i can think of when its more than a box is the conditional 16kA thing and back up protection, I cant remember the last time i had 6kA in a domestic property.
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I did change a Wylex a couple of years back neutral bar had burnt out it hadn't caught on fire but had smelt quit a bit. Probably due to something not being tightened properly.
As far as I am aware none of the consumer units I have fitted have had a problem and as you say it would be very unusual to get very high PSCC on a domestic.
As far as I am aware none of the consumer units I have fitted have had a problem and as you say it would be very unusual to get very high PSCC on a domestic.
safedepth
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Not trying to get a bite Dave, Just how my mind read it.
With regard to my views on compact RCBO's and mix and match. I think they look good and would use them except......... My concern lies in their availability. If you are the only source of supply for these items where do I go when I need a replacement at short notice or if you decide to retire/move/elope/pass away!
The beauty of wholesalers and their products is availability.
I am not a business man but my first thought on your method of sale is that you are limiting your customer base. I don't mean sell them in the sheds as you have rightly stated that is not the way ahead for the industry, but simply make them available to the wholesalers that you trust to sell to tradesmen only.
If I have missed a post covering this I apologise.
safedepth
Well-known member
Fair enough, I can see your point.Canoeboy said:
As I say I'm not a businessman but,
How about a website that required you to enter a scam membership number in order to place an order. Since these boards (appear) to be aimed at the domestic market that should cover a lot more possible customers than a forum alone. After all a diy'er could discover and order via this site simply by falsifying there status.
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What you mean some sort of a system with REAL teeth to discourage dangerous and illegal domestic electrical works and thus elevate the electrical profession to what it should be? Didn't one attempt at that just get a major dumbing down on 6th April?
If electricity kills then I say restrict the sale of the components like guns and ammo. The whole scam system is rigged anyway IMO towards cash generation when you can join some with JUST the 17th but others require 2391 to join. If any, then there should be ONE national body NOT a multitude.
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Hi Safedepth,
Please rest assured that I am already semi-retired and this side of my business is a profitable hobby. I am not about to move, but if I did, product would still be available.
I am not about to elope, because, at my age, there could be serious repercussions. One repercussion would be death by exhaustion, and unfortunately, I can't give you assurance on that subject. When I do fully retire, which means giving up my hobby, I have various people in the Trade, who would love to take over the business. I would be happy to do business with you, even on a credit basis and hope that if you die, you will not be owing me money!!
With regards to my customer base, I AM deliberately limiting it, firstly because it is Trade only and secondly because I don't want it to grow to level where my business loses its personal touch. If I sell to a wholesaler, he will want to re-sell my Compact RCBO for £18.50 + VAT. And who is this mythical wholesaler who sells to Trade only?? And would you pay £18.50 as an insurance against my demise??
I am not sure I follow your second post, but the ONLY people I sell to are those I believe to be genuine Trade ones. If any end user approaches me for kit, I pass it on to one of my customers and it has so far resulted in 5 - 6 jobs for them.
SBS Dave
Please rest assured that I am already semi-retired and this side of my business is a profitable hobby. I am not about to move, but if I did, product would still be available.
I am not about to elope, because, at my age, there could be serious repercussions. One repercussion would be death by exhaustion, and unfortunately, I can't give you assurance on that subject. When I do fully retire, which means giving up my hobby, I have various people in the Trade, who would love to take over the business. I would be happy to do business with you, even on a credit basis and hope that if you die, you will not be owing me money!!
With regards to my customer base, I AM deliberately limiting it, firstly because it is Trade only and secondly because I don't want it to grow to level where my business loses its personal touch. If I sell to a wholesaler, he will want to re-sell my Compact RCBO for £18.50 + VAT. And who is this mythical wholesaler who sells to Trade only?? And would you pay £18.50 as an insurance against my demise??
I am not sure I follow your second post, but the ONLY people I sell to are those I believe to be genuine Trade ones. If any end user approaches me for kit, I pass it on to one of my customers and it has so far resulted in 5 - 6 jobs for them.
SBS Dave
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