Lv Supply To New Builds

[Ian_H]

Hi,

I have a question about a LV supply to new builds, details as follows;

In April’13 I purchased an old house on a large plot with my sister and niece. We intended to take the old house down and build three new ones for ourselves to live in. I made a request to Northern Power Grid to disconnect the old house for demolition and to provide a quote for the new supplies …. The quote came back, shock horror, £16K! I questioned why so much to be told that they have to install a new cable which will entail excavating the road …. perhaps 60m! I asked why they can’t use the old supply (on my property) to be told it’s not big enough and it’s in the wrong place, also when the new houses are built if ever the owner of the house nearest the old main wanted to extend they would be building over it!

When the old supply was disconnected by Morrison Utilities I asked the Jointer if the cable was big enough for 3 houses, he told that the cable had two live wires in it and most definitely big enough for three houses. Unfortunately, the planner at NPG told me he was only saying what I wanted him to say. I don’t know how to argue that or what to do now! Can anybody offer some advice please?

Do I have to use NPG to do the work?

Why does it cost £16K for the new supply when the new gas supply from Northern Gas Networks are only charging £8K coming along the same road but twice the distance?

Is it really true that I can’t use the supply that is already on my property?

Thanks.

Ian

 

[ProDave]

You are usually stuck with their rules.

On your quote, it should have been broken down into contestable and non contestable items.  The contestable items you are free to get quotes from other contractors to do that part of the work.

 

[Evans Electric]

Much like the old " Electricity Boards "   the network companies are a law unto themselves.

But often, as Dave says,   you may be able to organize trenching & / or ducting on your land , up to the public footpath/ road.   But it MUST be done to their specification or they'll just walk away .   You can certainly  supply & fit meter boxes , but they're only about £25 each.   Speak to the engineer at   ,  Northern Power   is it?

They DO have many rules and regulations to adhere to , as do we who work after the meter.    I think that , these days , they have to install a separate cable to each  dwelling so they wouldn't be taking three supplies of your existing one .

I'm not sure what the jointer was telling you to be honest ,  although it is possible that the original cable is capable of feeding three houses , I would have expected there to be three "Live " wires perhaps .     I wouldn't hold much store by what he said. 

I'm told by the network here ( Western Power)  that there are quite high costs to merely working on the public roadway.  

(  As a pointer they will charge £800  just to re-position a domestic cable from inside a house to a meter box outside .... less than a days work)

 

[kerching]

There are a couple of reasons why they use "lube" when installing cables

One is to make it easier pulling the cable through the ducting and around the bends

Two is to reduce the level of pain as they shove an extortionate invoice up your 'John Sessions'

Note......a 'John Sessions' is a euphemism for the "orififce from which the Sun does not shine'

Just saying

 

[apprentice87]

Hi Ian,

First off, the chance of extending the one old service cable to feed three houses is nil, it was not designed for that.. Secondly, what have they quoted for?? it you want them to do all the digging, it will be expensive.. I know that you can employ others to do the digging on the road etc, but i would not.... They will have to dig up the road, take away all the stuff and put it somewhere, wait until all the cables have been installed, bring all the stuff back, and reinstate the road and do it all to the spec required by the DNO for the cable and the LA for the road, AND get and pay for a streetworks licence too.. Oh, and all barriers, maybe traffic lights etc. No way will you get this cheaper than the DNO will get their lot to do it for. Secondly, you do not know what network reinforcement works are needed, might be a new transformer, could be anything, the jointer will have no idea... As to why it cost more than the gas, the gas comes through cheapo plastic pipes, not expensive cables etc... What it costs is what it costs......

john...

 

[ProDave]

This is what I found when I get services onto my plot.

Both water and electricity had to come from the other side of the road.

Initial quote for water and electricity did not include the road crossing.

Independent contractor wanted £2K to make the road crossing. Scottish Hydro wanted £1800 to make the road crossing. Scottish water wanted £1000 to make the road crossing.

So I first got Scottish water to connect my water supply with them making the road crossing and at the same time laying in a duct to take electricity and telephone cables under the road.

As it happened, SW uncovered the Hydro's trunk cable that we had to connect to and passed the water pipe underneath it.  Rather than fill that in, I got them to leave that bit open, and I enlarged it to make a sensible sized connection pit.

So I now had a duct all the way from the connection pit, under the road and up into my meter box, with a drawstring.

On this basis I applied for a revised quote on the basis the pit was open, a duct was in place, all they had to do was pull the cable in and make the connections and I would back fill the connection pit. This saved them having to bring a digger and driver with them and the cost came down.

I appreciate it won't always happen that well, but it's certainly worth treating all your utility connections as a whole and seeing if there are any parts that are common like road crossings to keep the costs down.

The utilities are likely to be cheaper for a road crossing as they have a permanent road opening permit, whereas the private contractor has to apply to the council and pay their fee for each road opening they wish to make.

Don't forget a telephone connection while opening the road. Get Open Reach involved. In my case they free issued the cable and duct and I have the telephone cable under the road and presently coiled up on the grass verge where it will eventually be jointed, and a stake in the ground marking the exact location of their cable (next to the hydro cable) so we know exactly where to dig when it's connection time.

 

[Ian_H]

Hi,

Thanks to everybody who responded to my query, lots of information and things I didn't know.

We had the water supply installed a month ago, they brought it 160m for just over £8K (*) and they had to dig a long why down. Surprisingly the company who did the work was Morrison Utility who will also do the electrical work but a different department ... I have heard that water and electricity don't mix very well;-) I did ask if they could install the electrical cable at the same time but the response was a negative, I didn't think about the ducting.

(*)The initial quote for water was £13K but the new water supply would pass some other properties who had just had their spring water supply condemned so it was lucky for me in that regard. More users caused the water company to reduce the charge to £8.3K which we then split between the number of houses.

Back to the cable, it has three cores and I understand from the jointer that if was quite old but he definitely said it had two lives and a neutral which he showed me, testing with a neon screw driver, I've got a piece of it back at the site and will take a photograph later, perhaps tomorrow.  £16K just seems a horrendous amount of money when the supply is already on my site.

Thanks for your help.

Ian

 

[Richard-the-Ninth]

  £16K just seems a horrendous amount of money when the supply is already on my site.

Let me put it this way.

You want to take your family and the next door neighbours out some where. You are complaining that the transport you have is ok, after all its a car. But you have enough people to fill a coach, but you don't want to pay for a coach

______________________________

The electricity supply you have is just too small for the needs of 3 houses, its ok for one, just not big enough for 3.

 

[Steve3948]

We have just started a new install, UK Power are replacing supply and requires upgrade transformer at cost of 28k,

with all trenching and ducting carried out by builder at additional cost.