Motor Frame Size...

Here is one for Canoe!!

I have a motor, a rather elderly one [mid 1970's] It says on it "C160M" it is a foot AND flange mount [b35] although it does not say this on there.

If i ordered a new motor; C160M B35 Can i take it that it will fit, or are things not as simple as that....

john...

I would expect so John.

Obviously power & speeds also need to match.

With standard squirrel cage motors, I've never had an issue, if, they are the same frame size.

Next question though, is where to get one?...

Machinemart to a range of single & 3 phase motors. They do "their own" Clarke branded ones and another make I think. Bro in law just used a place on eBay for one and got a TEC unit. Only for a single phase cement mixer but seems OK.

Hi Canoe,

It is a 12kw 16 hp "newman" motor off my compressor. The thing has a bad vibration problem, and when i took it to bits i found that some of the fins on the rotor were a bit battered looking, there is one of the aluminium pins they use to hold balance weights on missing, and there is at least one balance weight missing off the rather heavy aluminium bell shaped fan [which is also a little distorted] Given that apparently it is around £250 to get it balanced, i wondered if i might be better just buying a new motor...

Only problem is, i have seen a motor listed, but the flange on mine is bigger...... I think......

Not sure what to do.

john...

john,

Hopefully this will give you the motor sizing details:

http://tecmotors.co.uk/sites/default/files/TECA%20Dime.pdf

&

http://tecmotors.co.uk/sites/default/files/TECA%20IE1%20Elec.pdf

Personally I would buy a TEC over anything from Machine Mart, as per Canoe suggesting, the links above are to the cheap Aluminium ranges.

However, there are better than TEC around also.

Cost is going to be a consideration on a motor of this size.

Hi Canoe,

Here is the name plate; http://s1178.photobucket.com/user/resistance87/media/2014_0506Image0009.jpg.html

Have not measured the flange yet as it is still bolted to the compressor!

john..

The BS number BS2613, B.S. 2613: 1957 The Electrical Performance of Rotating Electrical Machinery, is related to temperature rise of motors to this & other standards: 

BS 2655-2:1959 Specification for lifts, escalators, passenger conveyors and paternosters. Single-speed polyphase induction motors for driving lifts.

These were replaced by the BS4999 & BS5000 series of standards, many of which are still current, some replaced.

Such as:

BS EN 50347:2001 General purpose three-phase induction motors having standard dimensions and outputs. Frame numbers 56 to 315 and flange numbers 65 to 740.

&

BS 4999-141:2004+A1:2010 General requirements for rotating electrical machines. Specification for standard dimension.

As Canoe says, the motor seems to be an odd rating.

john

Can you get me some pics of the damaged area & missing bits please?

Hi Paul,

Here is a piccy of the armature of the thing when i first took it to bits. As you can see, it is fitted with a rather sturdy aluminum fan. Some numpty has given this a rough time and it has a fair bit, cannot remember exactly, but i suppose about  50 thou runout, plus i suspect that a balance weight might have come off, as one of the pins used to locate them is missing.

If you look closely at the armature itself, you can see that the fins have seen better days, and there is a balance weight pin missing off there too....

http://s1178.photobucket.com/user/resistance87/media/a.jpg.html

If you look at this photo when i was reassembling the thing, you can see the battered looking fins a bit better..

http://s1178.photobucket.com/user/resistance87/media/b.jpg.html

Problem was, when i ran the motor on its own, the bearings made a horrid noise. I replaced them, and it was exactly the same.....

It is not an electrical problem [so far as i know] because if you start the motor and then shut the power off, often the noise from the rear bearing continues for quite a while as it spins down, and if you rest your hand on the motor, as it slows, you can feel that as it slows through a certain speed range it will vibrate quite badly, and then smooth out as it slows some more.

I took the fan off and reassembled it, but it made no difference really. I have been messing with the thing for a few years, but i suppose i will have to take it to bits when i get round to it and get  it balanced, cannot see i can do much else.

I have not had a proper measure yet, but i wonder if the motor is a weird size, as when i look at the flange size for a c160m motor, it is about 350mm diameter. I have not measured mine properly, but it is more like 400mm.

All the windings look ok, and it is nice and clean inside, and it checks out ok when i mess about with a meter, so if i could sort the balance, i think it would be ok.

I have no idea where the best place to take the thing would be though, so long as it was not mega miles, i would take it to bits when i got time and hopefully, they could balance it while i waited, i could always sweep the factory floor or something. Scared they would balance it and the postman bash it about again.....

john...

See, it looked all nice and lovely, and when i finally stuck the end on, it ran crap.... I was well disappointed.....

http://s1178.photobucket.com/user/resistance87/media/c.jpg.html

john..

Hi Canoe,

I would go for a decent motor i think... Not sure about the overloading, it is driving a compressor, so i suppose the load is pretty well fixed.. Perhaps bigger would be better????

That is the only thing. i think it might have a funny size flange.... I looked at drawings, and they are on about 350 diameter, mine is more like 400..... I will have to take the motor off the compressor again and have a proper measure...

john..

South wales.... I ought to take it to bits and bring it to show you, cannot remember where you are,,, somewhere in the far east. [England!!!!] not as in oriental!!!

john..

South East Wales John!

Yes, I know where you are!!!! I just measured the circumference of the thing, and it works out at an OD of about 402mm

Must be a funny size. When i took it to bits i did not notice any fins missing, so perhaps someone has taken them all off and dressed it all smooth with a die grinder...

Only ever done a few motors, do they all normally have fins at both ends then??

john..

No I'm in South West Wales John, you, are in South East Wales!

Yes, a "normal" motor would have "fins" either end of the rotor laminations.

I'll ring a guy tomorrow who works for a big global motor repair facility in Swansea, but, has his own repair shop also.

I'll ask him about balancing.

I have got my vibration analyser going again, but, I have not used it for 10 years!

Plus I don't have a balancing machine apparatus, just the measuring device.

I have thought about knocking something up, but my analyser relies on a constant speed as it is VERY basic!

It's a [SIZE=11pt]Schenk Vibrometer 25.[/SIZE]

IIRC I've balanced "motors" before (a long, long time ago) but they were much smaller and ran a damn sight faster... some were even air driven

I was thinking of getting the sort of thing you use to balance grinding wheels, [or at least you did when i was a kid] but just cos it is in static balance means nothing.... [grinding wheels not being 2 foot wide!!]

john..

Canoeboy said:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/30-KG-SOFT-BEARING-BALANCING-MACHINE-GENERAL-PURPOSE-TURBO-COMPRESSORS-ROTORS-/271033799644?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f1adf93dc

Click to expand...

I'll bet you could make one of them out of a mangle,,,,,   

Yes!!!! One of them!!! Noooowwwwww, If i had one of them.... Bit pricey to click on the "buy it now though!!!!

Here is the contraption the motor is off:

http://s1178.photobucket.com/user/resistance87/media/e.jpg.html

You will be glad to hear i only had to fetch it about half a mile, not light!!!

Here you can see the oversized flange on the motor

http://s1178.photobucket.com/user/resistance87/media/d.jpg.html

The control gear is all in proportion too....

http://s1178.photobucket.com/user/resistance87/media/BWC40Supercomplicatedstarter.jpg.html

I just want it so i can sandblast bits of old motorbike and the like. I think it is about 60CFM so should be ok!!! I have had it running, and it produces unbelievable amounts of air!!

Neighbours just going to love this thing!!!!

john....

Control gear is not super complicated Y/D with control Tx & fuses I would say, pressure switch and an unloader contactor, valve & timer I would guess.

have you simply bolted a mini axle to a pallet?!?!?!   :|