Am I expected to be competant in Extractor fan installs as a bs7671 electrician?

[Leigh Winspear]

Hi yall,
A customer I have quoted for seems to expect that other than installing a 230v feed/supply for an en suite extractor fan, as an electrician, we are supposed to plumb in the outlet, tie into the existing vent and/or do the necessary brickwork removal, sealing and tile work etc.......Since when?

In the whole bs7671 regs book, there is absolutely no mention of extractor fans - at all. (not that I was expecting there to be)!

As an electrician, we adhere to Part P of the building regs where as ventilation is part F.......

Ill certainly at least research and probrably do a cpd or 3 before choosing whether or not to take on the job as a whole.

Where does this expectancy come from anyone?

Cheers n stuff

Leigh

 

[Murdoch]

Yes. Install fan means that - a working complete fan. Surely you've done these before

As for brickwork - you need a decent core drill and bits.

Tiles ?

If I do an inline fan which needs a tile vent I tell the customer its up to them to get the tile vent fitted.

 

[Geoff1946]

Thinking from a customer's point of view, I would expect a quote from you for the whole job.
If part of it falls outside your expertise/capability (e.g. roofing work), I would expect you to subcontract and manage that element of it.

 

[ProDave]

It is up to you. Personally I only do the electrics. Last one I did recently I put the fan in the ceiling, wired it, and left the outlet hose ready for the roofer to come, fit a vent tile and attach it. This was agreed with the home owner before i started the job. If the owner had not agreed she would have been looking for a different electrician.

 

[Leigh Winspear]

Cheers for the replies chaps.
Yeah Ive just been to another job and ive now got 3 to fit and 2 to repair/fault find in total now.
Ive done a few cooker hoods before so will be fine im sure. Luckily just bought a new 117mm core drill too.

It was just the expectation that I would do it all that threw me a bit.

I guess clear communication with the customer is key if some other trade needs to finish the complete install.

Any brands you favour?

 

[Andy™]

Since when?

since most of us are capable of doing the full job and not limited to just sticking a few wires into terminals and getting someone else to do most of the work

 

[binky]

I try to avoid the building work as such, but have done it many times. Easier options for an upstairs bathroom is a ceiling fan and vent in the soffits. Core drilling, once the pilot drill is through you can do that from both sides, this avoids blowing lots of external render off , or chipping out the brick edges, so keeps internal and external edges clean. Not my favourite job. Once you have core drilled both sides a few inches, it's sometimes easier just to use a chisel bit, core drilling is ruddy slow.

 

[Andy™]

I try to avoid the building work as such, but have done it many times. Easier options for an upstairs bathroom is a ceiling fan and vent in the soffits. Core drilling, once the pilot drill is through you can do that from both sides, this avoids blowing lots of external render off , or chipping out the brick edges, so keeps internal and external edges clean. Not my favourite job. Once you have core drilled both sides a few inches, it's sometimes easier just to use a chisel bit, core drilling is ruddy slow.

decent core bit & drill and you'll get through easily from one side. i don't use a pilot bit either

im also lazy, drill all the way through from inside, throw rope through, attach rope to vent with plenty adhesive / silicone on, use rope to pull up and into place from inside. no need to get the ladders out and no working at height

 

[Leigh Winspear]

since most of us are capable of doing the full job and not limited to just sticking a few wires into terminals and getting someone else to do most of the work

Our survey says 51% then........therefore most of us?
I have a point though as electricians are part P not part F..............

decent core bit & drill and you'll get through easily from one side. i don't use a pilot bit either

im also lazy, drill all the way through from inside, throw rope through, attach rope to vent with plenty adhesive / silicone on, use rope to pull up and into place from inside. no need to get the ladders out and no working at height

Like it..............................

found this - https://www.efixx.co.uk/envirovent

 

[Murdoch]

OP so you’ve bought a 117mm core drill bit

Do you have a proper core drill ?

 

[Leigh Winspear]

OP so you’ve bought a 117mm core drill bit

Do you have a proper core drill ?

as in sds plus yes, 2 x makita and a plug in dewalt thats a beast if reqd........

 

[Leigh Winspear]

as in sds plus yes, 2 x makita and a plug in dewalt thats a beast if reqd........

another problem to overcome is the customer wants me to use an existing extractor solid ducting to tie into, with the new en suite extractor. Looking for kits now.......

 

[Murdoch]

as in sds plus yes, 2 x makita and a plug in dewalt thats a beast if reqd........

Do any of them have a clutch?

 

[binky]

decent core bit & drill and you'll get through easily from one side. i don't use a pilot bit either

Pilot bit is not needed once you have the hole started. Round here we have quite a few cob walls, so could hit slate or granite stones, or both. Most houses are also rendered - a by prouduct of the China clay indusrtry means lots of silver sand was available cheap, and rendering is popular becuase of the rainfall. So you start off hard render, then hit lumps of granite / slate and ancient mortar, then hard render again - right pain in the neck, and easier hit from both sides! And just for fun, halfway through the wall a lump of granite falls down and jams the core..

 

[Leigh Winspear]

Do any of them have a clutch?

As far as im aware, only my drill drivers have a clutch.......are you telling me one is usefull when blasting through with an sds? never considered tbh......

 

[Leigh Winspear]

Pilot bit is not needed once you have the hole started. Round here we have quite a few cob walls, so could hit slate or granite stones, or both. Most houses are also rendered - a by prouduct of the China clay indusrtry means lots of silver sand was available cheap, and rendering is popular becuase of the rainfall. So you start off hard render, then hit lumps of granite / slate and ancient mortar, then hard render again - right pain in the neck, and easier hit from both sides! And just for fun, halfway through the wall a lump of granite falls down and jams the core..

wow, sounds fun................ i remember a few encounters when core drilling through for a cooker hood, then once the core drill bit is removed it was like a snow globe with all the cavity wall insulation wanting to escape. A few tesco carrier bags sorted the problem........

 

[Andy™]

as in sds plus yes, 2 x makita and a plug in dewalt thats a beast if reqd........

sds are not normally suitable for core drilling

 

[Leigh Winspear]

Tbh, between me doing a bit of research, you guys on here and a good team of on site fellow trades, ill be alreet......................

 

[Andy™]

Pilot bit is not needed once you have the hole started. Round here we have quite a few cob walls, so could hit slate or granite stones, or both. Most houses are also rendered - a by prouduct of the China clay indusrtry means lots of silver sand was available cheap, and rendering is popular becuase of the rainfall. So you start off hard render, then hit lumps of granite / slate and ancient mortar, then hard render again - right pain in the neck, and easier hit from both sides! And just for fun, halfway through the wall a lump of granite falls down and jams the core..

i don't even use pilot bits to start the hole. partially because mine can't take a pilot - they have built in extraction using the centre bore so a pilot bit doesn't fit in

easiest way is i have a piece of wood with the relevant core size hole in it. the wood is screwed to the wall and you can use that to start your hole. and if you have the holes in your wood in the same place as the fixings for your fan, then you don't need to drill any more fixings holes since they are already there

or you can just kinda hold the core on an angle and start it that way. its messy and exact starting point will vary from where you can it, along with chewing up some of the wall, but if its being plastered / tiled etc later then that doesn't matter

probably worst one I've done, wall was about 800mm thick. mix of stone, cement, other shite etc. core drill went through and cut no problem at all. the problem was getting in far enough to break out the bit that's been cut, so that the core drill could then get further in and keep going

 

[ProDave]

Most SDS drills have a clutch. I discovered mine has one when a long drill bit (not a core) jammed and I thought it had stripped the gearbox, but it was just the clutch slipping so the drill was not wrenched out of my hand.