holding certs until payment

can we withhold certificates until payment has been made? think i have abit of a slow paying customer!

Not as far as I am aware you can't.

AndyGuinness

can we withhold certificates until payment has been made? think i have abit of a slow paying customer!

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until you issue cert, then you have not finished your work to 7671, therefore until you give cert and finish the job, you wont get paid....

but you can always try it

and for part p notification, notify, but send it to your address

I damn well would !!!

I know Specs would disagree but its a useful weapon , specially if its under building control.

Use BS ... do your tests but tell them you need to come to come back to do "final test" and issue cert , if you can have my cheque ready when I call ....

Perhaps quote should say " Certs issued with final payment"

Lets compare......... take your car in for repair ..... man gives you the bill... you pay him... he gives you the keys.

This is what really gets my goat but luckily these days the people i work for usually pay me promptly. To me unless you have been paid the job ain't finished.

In short the answer is no, once you hand over any electrical installation you have to supply the certificates, however, one way to get around this is to issue a temporary supply certificate, which can run out within a week or month, doing this you have fully complied with the regulations and on payment you can complete the works which can simply be a case of sleeving a switch wire. I have used this ploy many times, and have never found any problems. My argument has always been that the installation is not complete, or finished until I say it is, not when the builder or client says it is. When I or should I say my company get final payment, then the certificates are issued.

You could issue cert and date for 60 days :slap Reissue another for x years when they pay up which should be well within 60 days

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reminds me of a few years back when I worked for a 'heating' firm and the QS really didnt have a clue,

me and the apprentice used to write all sorts on the forms,

done one one friday that was dated "till we get to the pub"!!!

didnt matter what readings we put on the certs we never got pulled for anything,

in the end we stopped signing them and put random names down.

the guy really was a noob,,,,,,,

can we withhold certificates until payment has been made? think i have abit of a slow paying customer!

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I damn well would !!!I know Specs would disagree but its a useful weapon , specially if its under building control.

Use BS ... do your tests but tell them you need to come to come back to do "final test" and issue cert , if you can have my cheque ready when I call ....

Perhaps quote should say " Certs issued with final payment"

Lets compare......... take your car in for repair ..... man gives you the bill... you pay him... he gives you the keys.

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Or the other way is to ensure you have a formally signed agreement for the works and the costs...

build into the agreement, part payments at stages....

e.g.

All material costs due on commencement..

if it

I see it like this .

You go out there, listen to what they what doing, go away and type up an estimate or quotation .

Then you buy , say,

reminds me of a few years back when I worked for a 'heating' firm and the QS really didnt have a clue,me and the apprentice used to write all sorts on the forms,

done one one friday that was dated "till we get to the pub"!!!

didnt matter what readings we put on the certs we never got pulled for anything,

in the end we stopped signing them and put random names down.

the guy really was a noob,,,,,,,

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I'm willing to bet 99% of certificates never even get read, and of the 1% that does, most people reading it won't understand it.

Most probably don't get kept in a safe place either.

This is based on mostly working on domestic and NEVER finding any previous certificates even on a house only 2 years old. You do occasionaly find previous certificated on industrial stuff.

Never come across previous certs etc.

Lucky to get a marked up board TBH even in this day and age.

Hi all,

I see it like this....If you took you books to an accountant to be done, do you think he would give them back and sign off your accounts until he had been paid??? I think not...

If you take your car for an mot, do you think they will give you the cert until they have been paid??? I think not...

If you do exams in a college, do you think you will get you certs until you have paid??? I think not...

So..... What do you think you should do with YOUR certs until you have been paid.....

john.....

Aparently the Schemes frown upon witholding certs.

I, however, withold all certs till payment is made in full. Particularly effective when the pP is needed to obtain a completion cert from LABC.

Issue a cert- then you cover yourself

If I get a situation like this (I use easycert) and issue a cert that isn't signed (name just printed).

The cert is watermarked 'copy- not valid' and the signature box is blacked out with black marker

Then you issue a correct cert when payments are recieved

Further to my post #11

I would have thought the ONLY time withholding a certificate might have any leverage, would be if they NEED the certificate for building control.

If it's a non notifiable job on a domestic property, most homeowners wouldn't give a hoot if they had no certificate.

So be careful, saying "no certificate until I'm paid" in some cases might result in the customer waiting even longer to pay, or even hoping to get away without paying as he doesn't want the certificate.

The usual reaction when I issue a certificate to most domestic customers is a confused look at the bits of paper and a "WTF do I do with this" sort of comment.

On the nail there Dave , in my post I did say " Building control "work.

Often you are only there as a Part P,er because of buiding control , otherwise their uncle would have done it ,as he knows how to do electrics 'cos he,s a decorator.

I actually have text on my invoices which says that certificates will only be provided upon receipt of cleared funds. It is the only leverage we really have and is one angle that I have even been advised to adopt by my NIC assessor.

If pushed, say by a builder who needs a cert to get paid so he can pay me then I issue the cert but using PIRform software I have the option to have text plastered all over the cert in big bold letters stating 'draft copy' or whatever other text I decide. I tell all customers that a certificate will be with them within 14 days which actually means that for private domestic customers their cheque has cleared by then.

Next week I take my car in for its MOT, I know some stuff needs sorting ((I'm not playing wtih hydrauilc suspension with out a pit))

What i do not expect to do is drive away with my car and an MOT certificute without paying for it all, so why should anyone else expect that, the problem is there is no goverment database for electrical work.

I am going to edit this when I get my thoughts in order (and get another drink)

NIC said once, give the client a photo copy BS7671 from the regs, and send them that. unpon payment send them the NICEIC certificate

NIC said once, give the client a photo copy BS7671 from the regs, and send them that. unpon payment send them the NICEIC certificate

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But a photocopy from the back of the BGB, hand filled in, is a perfectly valid certificate. So why would the customer want anything more. They don't care if it's printed on pretty coloured paper with a scheme logo on it. That doesn't make it more or less valid.