lighting query

I have a small problem regarding my lighting at home. My upstairs lights work and my downstairs hall light too but, the lounge and kitchen lights do not work. I am thinking that somewhere the cable is damaged that connects the ceiling roses together electrically. I don`t know if i have ceiling rose or junction box wiring and im not sure where to start looking for the fault, has anyone any ideas how or where i should start?

call an electrician.

Have you checked your fuse-board (consumer unit as we call it these days) your upstairs lights are likelly to be on a different circuit to the downstairs lights

All on one fuse. As is cooker and

sockets

Alan,

Welcome to the forum.

So, your lights, cooker & sockets on all floors are on the same fuse?

if you do decide to fiddle around, be aware that they could be live and the fault could be on the neutral.....

New light fitting recently? 

I have found a few times one of the loop conductors disconnected in ceiling rose after a cheap TFL has gone bang.

Does this really happen or was it just loose in the first place?

Sidewinder said:

Alan,

Welcome to the forum.

So, your lights, cooker & sockets on all floors are on the same fuse?

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He may mean the residual current device??

I think he means one circuit for all lights, one for all sockets and one for the cooker, probably in a 4 way wylex wooden backed fuse box.

If there really is just one fuse for all lights then it has to be a broken connection somewhere. It's quite likely with an installation that old that it's wired to a central junction box somewhere, quite possibly using screwits.

I would say a job for an electrician rather than a DIY job.

Sidewinder said:

Alan,

Welcome to the forum.

So, your lights, cooker & sockets on all floors are on the same fuse?

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The cooker is on one fuse, the lights on another etc. Upstairs an downstairs lights are on the same circuit breaker

It sounds like you have an older installation It would be a good idea to get inspected by a reputable electrician.

As for your issue, If you feel confident turn off the lighting circuit breakers and unscrew the base of the ceiling roses on the fittings closest to where there is no power and the ones without power.

Look for loose connections or signs of arcing.

There may indeed be a fault in the cable in which case it would be best to get an electrician to have a look as they will have the correct equipment to find the fault.

...and as soon as you unscrew it and BEFORE you disturb anything, take a couple of pics of the wiring!...it may help, you/be needed later on

just advising

ProDave said:

It's quite likely with an installation that old that it's wired to a central junction box somewhere, quite possibly using screwits.

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I agree. The lights may have been wired using the spider method. The central junction box/es is/are often on the landing, a decent spark will have written something on the floorboard that it's under. If most light fittings and light switches only have one cable connected to them then it's possible that this method was used. To be extra safe I would switch off the whole consumer unit before attempting to locate the central junction box. Inside you should look for the 2 main connections which will probably have approx 6 - 8 neutrals and 6 - 8 lives in. Make sure all the neutrals and permanent lives are connected together. If you still have problems after that then call an electrician.

Its name is octopus wiring, spider web is something totally different.

I dont think we ever used a name for it. It was either "3 plate" or joint boxes. I loved doing JBs especially 601s.

pair of mains in the middle two terminals, 3 for switch wires and one for earth( unless you were doing a top twist).  Which some left so short you could not get the lid off. Then Ashley brought out the 'earth bar' that went under the JB and gave younTWO earth terminals!....did not last long though. Never actually ever met anyone who remembers them!

just loving Wagos et al

I did a bit of remodelling work on my house and the most logical way of wiring the 1st floor lights was octopus. A central JB hidden behind the wall of my 2nd floor darkroom along with plenty of spare cables run for when SWMBO changed her mind yet again about where a fitting should be. The darkroom was sealed and fireproofed, once the floor was down and all the equipment in there was no way that floor was coming up again.

Wago’s weren’t around then so I used Weidmuller terminals in a 12x12” adaptable box. The jumper bars for the DIN rail connectors are great for when you need a common bus.

steptoe said:

View attachment 7219

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Someone will be along shortly to,say "are those glands suitable for more than one cable?"...but it wont be me!

dont do as my mate did..He forgot to link the to earth blocks together!.....took pic to show me, put box under floor, screwed floor down......and then i dropped the bombshell for him

oh how we laughed

steptoe said:

View attachment 7219

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Now I know why I like Weidmuller terminals. :Salute

My assessor wanted to know why so many people still use loop at light method,?

I very seldom do, my ow place is a mix of switch direct to light, live to light and switch to light, live to switch, 

As a guy I work with said, my wiring is to the commonly used paddy method, 

make it up as you go along as to what works best for the situation, 

Why so many people are stuck as to, this is how its always been , beats me

The glands, well, more than one cable fits, so yes, they are suitable for more than one cable, :C

A lot of non 'standard' stuff in that place, and not a single thing from assessor apart from wondering why I done it the way I had, he quite liked the non 'conventional' approach tbh,

Tony S said:

Now I know why I like Weidmuller terminals. :Salute

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What are they @Tony S ?