Ring vs Radial

[PBC_1966]

But if you had designed that right you would have had a ring main for machines and another for the other sockets in the kitchen. Well I would anyway.

That's my point. The houses where we see one separate ring for the whole kitchen/utility area (or a one ring up/one ring down arrangement so the downstairs ring feeds the whole kitchen/utility area) even though it's known that there will be washer, dryer, dishwasher etc. all on that ring in addition to the kettle, microwave oven and so on are badly designed by not taking into account the potential loading.

 

[gselectrical]

I voted rings, not so sure after reading all the comments now! Its what I use anyway.

Atleast a ring can always be split into 2 radials should a cable become damaged between 2 sockets.

J

 

[ianmacd]

Atleast a ring can always be split into 2 radials should a cable become damaged between 2 sockets.

Before or after the cable has been overloaded .

Nice pic btw.

 

[gselectrical]

Before or after the cable has been overloaded .Nice pic btw.

Why Thank you. :^O

 

[PC Electrics]

I've just edged radials in to the lead: 21 to 20.

Most of the houses near me on a '60s estate have only one ring. I've changed the CU in several houses where they have been extended (the houses that is) and the single ring has been extended round the whole house rather than adding in another. At least two houses extended by Bodgit and Scarper had spur on spur on spur........ so to make the circuit safe I've put the whole house on a 20A. Not had any call backs yet about MCB tripping. So, the empirical evidence would suggest that just one 20A circuit is sufficient to supply a small to medium family home.

When rewiring I put a 32A/4mm radial into the kitchen & utility and 1 or 2 20A radials into the rest of the house (depending on it's size).

All the other circuits (lights heating shower cooker) are radials too!!

 

[batty]

I've just edged radials in to the lead: 21 to 20.Most of the houses near me on a '60s estate have only one ring. I've changed the CU in several houses where they have been extended (the houses that is) and the single ring has been extended round the whole house rather than adding in another. At least two houses extended by Bodgit and Scarper had spur on spur on spur........ so to make the circuit safe I've put the whole house on a 20A. Not had any call backs yet about MCB tripping. So, the empirical evidence would suggest that just one 20A circuit is sufficient to supply a small to medium family home.

When rewiring I put a 32A/4mm radial into the kitchen & utility and 1 or 2 20A radials into the rest of the house (depending on it's size).

All the other circuits (lights heating shower cooker) are radials too!!

I listen to what customers say and have been told by some that they have had hoovers trip out 20 amp circuit breakers so I will carry on with ring mains.

 

[PBC_1966]

It is quite amazing just how diversity will let people get away with a lot in some situations. I remember a house a few years ago I worked on. One of those big Victorian three-story places in a nearby seaside town which had been used as a guest house - About five or six bedrooms, each with its own electric wall heater, plus another owner's bedroom in the converted attic, a couple of bathrooms with instant electric showers, immersion heater for the rest of the hot water, and an electric stove, although there was an Aga-type range as well, so it probably didn't get heavy use. Somehow the whole place was still running on an old 30A service.

 

[Apache]

I listen to what customers say and have been told by some that they have had hoovers trip out 20 amp circuit breakers so I will carry on with ring mains.

That must be one hell of a hoover!

 

[M107]

I do 2.5mm ring final for the kitchens/utility rooms & radials for other rooms. Normally split the radials to be front/rear or left/right of property, rather than upstairs/downstairs.

 

[bengie]

This is what I've already done, as I've mentioned before, and I have never understodd where this upstairs\downstairs ring comes from. It is very rare to see a new property wired as upstairs\downstairs ring and anyone wiring rings as such clearly isn;t thinking about the job.

your post has confused me slightly, personally i would wire one ring for the kitchen or more if if very large and then one ring up and one ring down. as already said all the heavy appliances are seperate to the up/down rings and they both only have tv/dvd/games/lamps etc and if anything i would say the heavier use would be upstairs in the house of a modern family what with all kids seeming to have the tv/dvd/laptop/xbox/ps3 etc so potentially 2 or 3 of eacch upstairs where as more likely to only have one of each downstairs as its the general living area.

i split the kitchen from rest of the ground floor and the upstairs so if there is an issue on the circuit you don't lose the lot.

i fail to see how its not thinking about the job, its just a difference of opinion.

 

[Lurch]

your post has confused me slightly, personally i would wire one ring for the kitchen or more if if very large and then one ring up and one ring down. as already said all the heavy appliances are seperate to the up/down rings and they both only have tv/dvd/games/lamps etc and if anything i would say the heavier use would be upstairs in the house of a modern family what with all kids seeming to have the tv/dvd/laptop/xbox/ps3 etc so potentially 2 or 3 of eacch upstairs where as more likely to only have one of each downstairs as its the general living area.i split the kitchen from rest of the ground floor and the upstairs so if there is an issue on the circuit you don't lose the lot.

I wire back\front because with up\down you have 2 rings running up and down the same route so you are in effect doubling the amount of cable you are using. With back\front you run one leg to a socket then continue round, looping up and down on the way to all the sockets at that end of the house so you have 1 cable running round one end of the house pretty much. If you were to use the up\down method then you'd run one cable round and drop down to downstairs sockets, then follow the same route with another cable doing the upstairs, twice as much cable. There's no need for it, bad planning IMO.

i fail to see how its not thinking about the job, its just a difference of opinion.

I'm not saying it's a major issue, or that doing up\down rather front\back shows a complete lack of thinking or knowing, but as I mention above, I try and use the most efficient method of cabling something, saves me time and money and in most case, the customer too.

 

[bengie]

oh i see, you meant thinking in terms of time/cost rather than electrical safety/practicality

i can certainly see some sense to wiring front/back other than the saved cable as if one circuit goes down you've still power on that floor.

 

[sellers]

I can kind of understand why you do back/front. Definatley in a house with a solid ground floor, and especially if your too soft or fat to get under the floorboards downstairs .

The added time and mess in chasing the longer run musn't be worth it. To me getting on your hands and knees and getting dirty for a couple of hours is worth it, you can then wire the downstairs very quickly. Time is money.

 

[Lurch]

I can kind of understand why you do back/front. Definatley in a house with a solid ground floor, and especially if your too soft or fat to get under the floorboards downstairs .

Sure, yeah. Most places are solid floors though, or are a bit less than thin person crawling under sort of sized.

Also same applies to new builds, which would always be done from above anyway, not least because because they all have solid floors.

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

I can kind of understand why you do back/front. Definitely in a house with a solid ground floor, and especially if your too soft or fat to get under the floorboards downstairs .The added time and mess in chasing the longer run musn't be worth it. To me getting on your hands and knees and getting dirty for a couple of hours is worth it, you can then wire the downstairs very quickly. Time is money.

Concur!Applaud Smiley

Downstairs circuit under floorboards.. is a no brainer!!

Shorter cable runs..

Less time..

Piece of wee wee IMHO!

no point going up & over all the time.. doubling up runs up & down walls!